Tuesday, 20 January 2009

Amazing Grace

I have always been reluctant to share my conversion story; at times I have been weak in faith and have doubted how everything happened, mainly because I had not heard another believer who was converted in a similar way to mine. I never said a prayer or went through periods of time seeking God; I never met an evangelist or hear the gospel from a believer. I got converted because the Lord revealed Himself to me and changed my heart.
In 2005, my life had reached a point of which everything was just wrong. I had more enemies in my life than friends, some people had really hurt me and gone out their way to make my life a misery, I hated them so much and I wanted revenge. I had become a very angry bitter woman, and found it impossible to let go and forgive. Little did I know that things were about to change. In December 2005, I woke up one morning feeling like I had had a complete character and personality transplant over night. I felt different, it was strange. As days went on I noticed a radical change in the way I thought, this was a shock to me. I now loved my enemies; all the bitterness and anger I felt towards them seemed to had just vanished. The weirdest thing for me was I had no control over my feelings, I knew this was not the normal me, I felt so relieved both in my mind and body, it was the most beautiful feeling I had ever experienced all my life and I did not want to lose it. It took me about 2 weeks to realise that I had no grudge whatsoever to every person who had ever hurt me in life, I had forgiven. At that point I was feeling a power at work in me, a power that was alien to me.I had no idea what it was, but it felt so powerful, I felt like I was going to explode with the amount of love for those who hated me. During this time my husband and I visited family friends, we never spoke about religion with this couple but on this night strangely our friends started discussing if God was real and about religion. The moment our friend mentioned the name ‘God’, I felt like someone had spoke right through my heart. I started panicking, but in a good way. I then knew in my heart that it was God who was calling me. Suddenly to my own surprise I started talking to our friends about God's love and forgiveness. I started preaching to them that we need to forgive our enemies for us to be free. I was talking about how God forgives us if we love our enemies. At this point I had no idea what I was talking about, the words just started coming out and I had no control over what I was thinking or saying, I was enjoying it, and everyone just looked at me as if to say, what has got into you? Just hearing the name God, seemed to have put me on fire.

On our way home I was telling my husband that I now knew what was happening to me, that God was calling me. At this point I did not comprehend what I was saying; even claiming that God was calling me frightened me, it so did not sound like me. I was telling my husband that I am naturally a bitter angry woman, but the previous two weeks all that had gone and all I felt was love. We never used to speak about religious stuff, but this time my husband had seen the power working in me, that he was in total agreement that something supernatural was going on in his wife. That night I could not sleep, I was troubled in my heart, I felt restless. I had bought a bible a few years back when I was at University; I had bought it just to add to my book collection, but never used to read it. We had recently moved to our new home so some of the clutter was still in our garage. And my bible was in somewhere in the clutter. That night all I could think of was that bible. I could not wait till morning to find it, I felt like that something that had been working in me was telling me to read my bible, the urge was strong, I can not describe it fully in words.

The next day I rushed to the garage to find this bible. To my amazement it took me a few minutes to find it. I rushed back in the house clutching this bible, like a child who had found a treasure, my heart was pounding, but the feeling was beautiful. I was scared what I was going to find in this book, which now seemed sacred to me. I opened it, and to my amazement I remember reading something about how God is love. Then I went on flipping the pages, I read about forgiving those who wrong you, so that God will forgive you too, everything I had been saying to my friends the previous day was in this book, at this point I was in total shock. I kept on flipping the pages, then all the joy turned into confusion, every page I turned to I saw a name that caught my eye, Jesus Christ. It seemed every page had this name. I had heard the name Jesus Christ countless times in my life, but for the first time in my life I had no idea who Jesus was. I could not understand it, I could feel the presence of God, it was so powerful, but yet I became so confused, who was Jesus? Why was His name in the bible? Why was I supposed to love Him? Suddenly I felt guilty that I did not know who Jesus was.
I left the bible on the floor, went to my bedroom, in deep confusion. I had prayed a few times before in my life, but this time I had a strong desire to pray and I now knew for sure that there was a God. It was my first prayer of faith. I fell on my knees and felt the courage to approach Him, ' God, I know you are there, I know it. You are calling me. I have felt your presence over the last two weeks, I can now forgive, and that’s not me. I know you are listening. I am confused, who is Jesus Christ? Am I supposed to love Him, if so why? Can you tell me why His name is in the bible, and why I should love Him?' I felt like God was there next me, and He was listening. After that prayer I felt a peace, all the worry and anxiety about not knowing Jesus just disappeared. Now looking back I can see from that moment I trusted God to reveal His Son to me.

After about three days of making this prayer, one afternoon I was at home doing my housework as usual when for the first time in my life, I saw myself as a sinner, this was different to how I had felt when I had the abortion, this time it was more real, I saw myself as to who I really was before God. I was a sinner. I felt sorry, guilty and grieved in my heart, that I had spent all my life sinning against a Holy God. All of a sudden as I was feeling guilty and sorry not knowing what to do, the name Jesus Christ come in my heart and mind. In my mind I then saw the cross, then I saw Jesus dying for my sins, paying for my punishment, suffering for me, the wrath of God being poured on Him, for all that I had done. I can not say I saw a real vision, but in my mind I beheld Jesus dying on the cross. That is the moment I believed. It became crystal clear to me who Jesus was and why I had never known Him, I loved Him. Jesus revealed Himself to me, I did not pray a prayer or ask Him to come into my heart. I just believed and from that moment and I felt free. I felt as though I had been bound in chains all my life, then the moment I believed in Jesus, my chains fell off, my heart was free! I was forgiven, I felt forgiven. I went from feeling guilty and helpless to feeling free and forgiven. From that moment I realised something had happened to me, I did know what it was at the time, but it was a supernatural transformation. I went to sit down to watch my favourite soaps, I could not do it, the desire had gone, I found it difficult to lie, I stopped playing the lottery. I felt like a complete different person, all the things I loved and enjoyed I now hated. Now I had a new desire, I wanted to know about Jesus, that's all I thought of. I had a strong desire to talk to God and read the bible. I would read my bible all the time, would go to bed with it. It became the most important thing in my life. As I was reading everyday, I was learning more and more about my Lord, it was just amazing.

My husband was in shock as he had no idea what was happening, everything was happening so fast. I too had no idea what was happening. All I knew was I was not the same person anymore, I now loved Jesus, I knew I was now forgiven, I felt free and I could not get enough of the Word of God. At this point I did not even know that what had happened to me had a name! I later found out through reading the bible more than four weeks later that I was now a Christian. It was amazing finding out that Jesus called it being born-again in John 3:3. I now knew that I was not a strange girl, I had been saved! I had believed in the Lord Jesus Christ for my salvation. Glory to God!

47 comments:

Edd said...

Amazing testimony, very encouraging to read, sounds similar to mines. I was never preached. My neighbor invited me after turning her down so many times. The church I went to and one I am a member of happened to be the same church my family went to when I was little. I don't recall doing the sinner's prayer but I was moved and felt God working in me on that Sunday afternoon. That night when I slept I felt relieved, peace pretty much the best sleep I ever had in my life. To make a long story short I am still a christian today after many pitfalls and stumblings. I am here today by God's grace and mercy and it still baffles me how he saved me.

Really nice blog, God bless you and your family.

Natasa said...

beautiful, powerful testimony...

Back2TheBible said...

Great testimony! When we accept Him, all thing become new!

notedscholar said...

This is interesting. But where does Barack Obama fit into this story?

NS

Tom Mahon said...

Jean said...

>>I fell on my knees and felt the courage to approach Him, ' God, I know you are there, I know it. You are calling me. I have felt your presence over the last two weeks, I can now forgive, and that’s not me.<<

In your long testimony, there isn't one single word of repentance for your past sins; no indication that you were ever baptised in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit; and no evidence that you have received the gift of the Holy Spirit, which is the earnest of the Christian inheritance.

Dani' El said...

That truly is a beautiful testimony, Jean!!

All glory to the Father and His Holy One!! He has indeed blessed you exceedingly with a wonderful testimony, knowledge, understanding, all the wonderful fruits of the Holy Spirit.

We truly do have much in common.
I can understand your shock at discovering the apostasy in England, imagine mine here in Sodom!
And the longing for fellowship, difficult for sure, but I know I only cling to God all the more for it!!

Funny, I was just thinking I was going to ask you for your conversion testimony and I came to your blog to see if you had written it before, and bingo!
there is was!!

(I stopped believing in coincidences on Aug 15 2005) :-)

I see you still have your accuser Tom on your heels.
Tom, you talk about repentance (Jean did write of hers despite your false charges) I encourage you to remove that plank from your eye, buddy.

Jean, I have you and your family in my prayers always.
Especially your kind husband.

Baruch HaShem!
Dani' El

Tom Mahon said...

Dani' El said...

>>I see you still have your accuser Tom on your heels.<<

What are you talking about? I read Jean's testimony and commented on what I thought was missing from it. Is that being her accuser?

>>Tom, you talk about repentance (Jean did write of hers despite your false charges) I encourage you to remove that plank from your eye,...<<

The first step in being converted is repentance. When people came to John The Baptist to be baptised, they came to him confessing their sins, not describing an unusual experience.

After repentance, they must be baptised in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit; and then have hands laid on them for the receipt of the Holy Spirit. If you read the account in Acts 19, you will see that people have to be properly baptised before God will grant them his Holy Spirit.

Jean may not understand me, and that is not surprising to me, for I am a genuine Christian. A genuine Christian understands some of the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, and although he or she always rejoices in the Lord, his/her zeal is underpinned by a profound knowledge of the Scriptures, as they explain the on folding plan of God in the redemption of his elect.

Tom Mahon said...

Hi All

I do apologise for my spelling of of unfolding. I would appreciate it if Jean could correct it for me?

Thanks

Tom

lordstrophy said...

Very powerful and amazing! It really does show that God moves in us and causes us to respond to His son......I was just speaking to my husband last night about my conversion....I know when I said a prayer and turned from some things that werent good in my life but I slipped away and back into the world and I know of the time that I fell on my face and begged God to change me because I could see myself for who I was......I thought I was saved but I knew I wasnt changed....when did He save me? I am not sure but He did....

Jean said...

Note to readers;

I have deleted my previous blog entry because I realised it could have had the potential to offend some. We are called to be at peace with all people, so I am trying to maintain that.

In Christian Love
Jean



Tom,

I did get baptised in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit about three months after God saved me, it was an act of obedience and it had nothing to do with me pursuing to receive 'the gift of the Holy Spirit' for the Lord had already given me the Holy Spirit the moment He saved me.

Dani' El said...

Tom wrote-
In your long testimony, there isn't one single word of repentance for your past sins;


But Jean wrote- "I went to sit down to watch my favourite soaps, I could not do it, the desire had gone, I could not lie, I stopped playing the lottery. I felt like a complete different person, all the things I loved and enjoyed I now hated. Now I had a new desire, I wanted to know about Jesus, that's all I thought of.

So you falsely accused her Tom.

You assumed that Jean had not been baptised, when her testimony was clearly not exhaustive.
Why are you assuming the worst about Jean?
Why are you in such a critical stance?

But lets put that aside.
Why have you not answered our questions?
What church do you belong to?
Do you hold to the doctrines of the heretic Armstrong?

If so, that explains your legalist accusations and hypocrisy.
I pray that God would grant you repentance.

Tom Mahon said...

Jean said...

>>I did get baptised in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit about three months after God saved me, it was an act of obedience and it had nothing to do with me pursuing to receive 'the gift of the Holy Spirit' for the Lord had already given me the Holy Spirit the moment He saved me.<<

Since you couldn't find a church where the people appeared to be zealous for God, I wonder who baptised you?

Also, one doesn't get baptised in pursuit of the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit is the gift which God gives to his elect, to enable them to live a life of sanctity and obedience(1 Pet.1:2).

Tom Mahon said...

Dani' El said...

Tom>>>In your long testimony, there isn't one single word of repentance for your past sins;<<

>>>But Jean wrote- "I went to sit down to watch my favourite soaps, I could not do it, the desire had gone, I could not lie, I stopped playing the lottery. I felt like a complete different person, all the things I loved and enjoyed I now hated. Now I had a new desire, I wanted to know about Jesus, that's all I thought of.<<<

YOU>>So you falsely accused her Tom.<<

Desiring to know Jesus, give up the Lottery and being disgusted with the sordid actualities of the human condition, as portrayed in "TV soaps," is not in itself repentance. Repentance is a gift of God. After Peter returned from visiting Cornelius, note what was said: "Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life"(Acts 11:18). And when Paul was discussing the mercy and judgment of God, note what he was inspired to write: "Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering, not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?"(Roms. 2:4). So no one can repent if God doesn't grant it. We may feel sorry or regret some wrong that we have done, but that is not repentance.

Repentance is a road to Damascus experience, and it accompanied by suffering, distress and grief. Note the Chosen Vessel's exhortation to the Hebrews, and by extension to all God's faithful people. "Call to remembrance the former days, in which, after you were illuminated, you endured a great fight of afflictions; Partly, whilst you were made a gazingstock both by reproaches an afflictions; and partly whilst you became companions of them that were so used"(Hebs.10:32-33).

It would be tedious and perhaps pointless to expand on the profound significance of the above passage. Suffice to say, that no one comes to God without pain and suffering.

>>You assumed that Jean had not been baptised, when her testimony was clearly not exhaustive.
Why are you assuming the worst about Jean?
Why are you in such a critical stance?<<

I didn't assume anything of the kind. I was just pointing out it was missing from her testimony.

Dani' El said...

Tom,
Will God grant you repentance for your heresy?
Will you have godly sorrow, like Jean clearly expressed despite yet another false accusation from you, for your refusal to tell the truth about your cult?
And your false prophet Armstrong?

You are in no position to criticize anyone yet it is all you seem to do.
Who made you the sheriff?

Your criticisms, your "pointing out" things that you find missing, are done in self righteous hypocrisy, and dwelling on works.
All of which smacks of Armstrong.

I re-read your original criticism and it drips of accusation and rebuke and is devoid of any sense of exhortation or loving constructive criticism.

And now after Jean informs you that she was indeed baptized, you attack again. Was the church and pastor up to Judge Tom's high standards?
I'm sure only a Armstrong church will be approved by Tom.

Tom, turn that glaring light on yourself.
May God grant repentance to YOU.

I challenge you again.
Do you follow the heretic Armstrong?

Another refusal to answer will be a "yes" in my book.
Then the only thing left to do is pray for you.

Dani' El said...

Since Tom refuses to confess it here, this is a rant from the top of Tom's blog against those who fled the WCG cult of Herbert Armstrong to which he belongs-

-------------------------------
It is also to help genuine Christians to distinguish between the character and role of Christ's faithful ministers, and the discredited cabal of former Worldwide Church of God hirelings, who are now operating in cog-land, preying upon misguided souls. Christ enjoined his ministers to, "feed my flock." Whereas, the hirelings in cog-land devious maxim is, "fleece the "flock" and feed ourselves."

In addition, there is a growing, irrational cabal of scoffers, who tend to post the most inane nonsense at AW Blog. These insane people exited WCG screaming, that they were duped and mugged every Sabbath by Mr. Herbert W. Armstrong, even though they were never coerced to attend services. These miserable scoffers were commanded "to prove all thing." But because they were either unwilling or incapable of proving anything, they have taken the easy option of blaming Mr. Armstrong for their delusions! What folly!

Tom Mahon said...

Dani' El said...

>>Since Tom refuses to confess it here, this is a rant from the top of Tom's blog against those who fled the WCG cult of Herbert Armstrong to which he belongs-<<

I have not refused to confess anything. Under Mr. Armstong's dispensation, WCG was the only church of God. After his death in 1986, his successor formed an alliance with the Evangelical Alliance of Churches, and adopted the protestant heresy of Sunday worship and the delusional doctrine that the law must not be obeyed, because Christians are under grace. Well, this teaching is utter nonsense!

However, I left WCG in 1995, and now keep services in my home with my family every Sabbath, which was the tradition of the Apostolic church, in obedience to the fourth commandment.

I note that you are reviling me by calling me a self righteous hypocrite, even though you don't know me. However, Jesus says: "When you are reviled, revile not again." So I will not be provoked into a slanging match with you or anyone else, for that matter.

Jean said...

Tom I am really sorry to hear this, I do not know where to start. But I am grateful to God that at least you are communicating with believers, I hope you repent towards the Living God and believe in Him, not in yourself. He will save you and cleanse you from sin, only He can do it Tom, you will never be able to save yourself. God helps those who can not help themselves, He came to seek and save that which is lost, not the righteous.

Anonymous said...

@Tom

Romans 6:14,We are no longer under law, but under grace...

Tom Mahon said...

Jean said...

>>Tom I am really sorry to hear this, I do not know where to start.<<

After reading your reply, I fell about laughing. But I will give you time to get started.-:)

Tom Mahon said...

Anonymous said...

>>Romans 6:14,We are no longer under law, but under grace...<<

I often ignore people who don't have the courage to add their names to their comments, but that you may know: "The law was given that grace may be sought, and grace was given that the law might be obeyed." But you won't understand this unless you have been weaned from the breast, and there is no indication that you are even a babe in Christ.

Dani' El said...

Tom,
Do you believe you will become a God one day?

http://www.ondoctrine.com/10armsth.htm

"God wants everyone of us to eventually become like Him."
"Why should it seem strange that you will someday be the spirit-composed child of your heavenly Father? You will be what He is - God."
"God's PURPOSE in having created humanity - in having caused YOU to be born - is to reproduce Himself."
Copyright © Herbert W. Armstrong

Tom Mahon said...

Dani' El said...

HWA>>"God wants everyone of us to eventually become like Him."
"Why should it seem strange that you will someday be the spirit-composed child of your heavenly Father? You will be what He is - God."
"God's PURPOSE in having created humanity - in having caused YOU to be born - is to reproduce Himself."<<

Posting this, and asking me if I believe I will become God is completely irrelevant. If you believe that what Mr. Armstrong wrote is heresy, then, show from the bible why it is heretical.

Dani' El said...

I'll take that as a yes, Tom.
When you acheive Diety status, please let us know.

And what of Armstrongs failed prophecies?
------------------------------

A prophecy about Mussolini:
"Undoubtedly, then, the "Beast" who will capture half the city of Jerusalem, fighting at Armageddon against Christ at his Second Coming, is MUSSOLINI, with ten European Dictators, and their armies! It is coming in This Generation!"
Herbert W. Armstrong, The Plain Truth, January 1939, p. 4

A prophecy about Hitler:
"And I saw the beast and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against - against whom? Not Britain and America! Not Israel - against Him that sat on the horse and His army (Rev. 19:19.) It is Christ and the Angels that Hitler will fight."
Herbert W. Armstrong, The Plain Truth, March/April 1943, p. 6

lyn said...

Tom, so tell us the proper 'procedure' one must go through, according to your standards, to live up to your definition of a 'true Christian' such as yourself.

No, don't bother, I don't want to feed your ego. May the Lord rebuke your arrogant prideful heart. You have NO RIGHT to assume Jean isn't saved based on YOUR pre-conceived notions.
Water baptism does not save, the only baptism that counts for salvation is that of the Holy Spirit{John 1:33}.

Your boastful claim "for I am a genuine Christian" speaks volumes. Where is the humility? Where is the thinking of others as better than yourself? Your prideful statement reminds me of the Pharisee's prayer in Luke 18..."Two men went up to the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, 'God, I thank You that I am not like other men--extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this tax collector. I fast twice a week; I give tithes of all that I possess.'

Dani'El is correct in pointing out Tom's cult of WCG. There is an informative piece on this at http://www.rapidnet.com/~jbeard/bdm/Cults/armstrong.htm

As for repentance, it isn't something you can whip up yourself Tom, only God can grant it "In humility correcting those who are in opposition, if God perhaps will grant them repentance, so that they may know the truth" 2 Timothy 2:25 A sinner knows when God has broken them over their condition, we don't need to rely on folks such as yourself to 'step in' and guide us.

What is the purpose of man Tom? "God's PURPOSE in having created humanity - in having caused YOU to be born - is to reproduce Himself." What a pride-filled boastful statement!! Do you believe this Tom? Where would I find this in scripture?
From Micah 6:8 "And what does the LORD require of you But to do justly, To love mercy, And to walk humbly with your God?"
You've come here before attacking Jean on a previous post concerning her daughter, once again you are back spewing your propaganda and flaunting your arrogant pride. May Almighty God bring low your proud heart, may He break you of your sin of pride and arrogance, as well as being argumentative and divisive, may He grant you repentance that leads to true salvation.
May the Lord continue to bless you sister Jean, and you my brother Dani'El. May the Lord be forever praised, for He truly is worthy!

Tom Mahon said...

Dani' El said...

>>I'll take that as a yes, Tom.<<

You may jump to any conclusion you wish.

However, I note that instead of sticking to the topic, you have digressed to talk about false prophecies. You originally asserted or implied that Mr. Armstrong statement was heresy. I asked you to show from the bible that it is heretical. If you can't show that it is heretical, and you just believe it is, say so. But don't butterfly-like skip from topic to topic, thinking that I won't notice your failure to provide the evidence in support of your bold, but misguided assertion.

Tom Mahon said...

lyn said...

>>Your boastful claim "for I am a genuine Christian" speaks volumes. Where is the humility? <<

Wow, Lyn!! Like Jean, I don't know where to start, but unlike her I will begin!

Do you want me to deny that I am a genuine Christian? Jesus stated that he was the son of God, and he was accused of blasphemy, and eventually crucified for speaking the truth. Was he lacking in humility for speaking the truth? Little do you know what true humility is.

>>As for repentance, it isn't something you can whip up yourself...<<

Here, you are just echoing what said.

>>Dani'El is correct in pointing out Tom's cult of WCG.<<

I don't want to speak for Dan, but he never said that WCG belongs to me, as you have asserted.

As for your prayers for me, may I suggest that you direct them towards someone else, as God knows my needs before I ask him.

lyn said...

From Jean's testimony...'For the first time in my life, I saw myself as a sinner, this was different to how I had felt when I had the abortion, this time it was more real, I saw myself as to who as to who I really was before God. I was a sinner. I felt sorry, guilty and grieved in my heart, that I had spent all my life sinning against a Holy God. All of a sudden as I was feeling guilty and sorry not knowing what to do, the name Jesus Christ come in my heart and mind.'

Jean, what a beautiful story of repentance!
Tom, why is it everyone can see Jean's repentance in her testimony but you? Perhaps your own pride has you blinded.
Also, in your own words, 'I don't want to speak for Dan, but he never said that WCG belongs to me, as you have asserted.'
Now, from Dani'El, 'or your refusal to tell the truth about your cult?
And your false prophet Armstrong?'

So Tom, do you consider Armstrong to be a prophet?


One last thing, you say, 'so I will not be provoked into a slanging match with you or anyone else, for that matter'...yet, you posted FIVE more times after that! Now then, either you are a liar, or you have a divisive spirit...which is it?

Dani' El said...

Tom,
No, it is just established that you believe that you will be equal to God one day.

So we can move to the next evidence of your cult member status.

So you again fail to answer, what of your prophet's failed prophecies?
What happened in 75?

And since we are talking about "your cult".
I believe you said you have split off from the WCG, and have started your own congregation.
Have you replaced Armstrong as the sole authority on earth?
Is your house church the only true church? all others damned?
Are you the new WCG Pope?

When one considers your bossy ways, and your authoritative stance, it would seem a safe assumption.
It's also safe to assume you will continue to avoid answering.

If any one has any questions as to Toms positions, simply go to his blog and read his rants.

It's also typical of cultists that they go and try to spread their disease, as Tom is doing here.

lyn said...

Dani'El is correct in calling out the obvious pride in Tom, as well as his cult system of beliefs.
What does the word of God say about the proud, the arrogant, the haughty?

"Whoever secretly slanders his neighbor, him I will destroy; No one who has a haughty look and an arrogant heart will I endure." Psalm 101:5
"Be of the same mind toward one another; do not be haughty in mind, but associate with the lowly. Do not be wise in your own estimation." Romans 12:16
"The fear of the LORD is to hate evil; Pride and arrogance and the evil way And the perverted mouth, I hate." Proverbs 8:13

I think we know what happened to the last one who wanted to be like the 'Most High'...

Marie said...

Hello Jean,

I just found your blog through Puritan Fellowship. What a wonderful testimony and a beautiful writing style you have! I'm looking forward to reading more of your former posts. I love Jesus as you do, and can relate to much of what you've said.

Maureen said...

Jean what a blessing your testimony was. Clearly we can see the experience of regeneration in your heart weeks before you bowed the knee to Christ in repentence. What an amazing, gracious God we have to bring our dead spirits to life and allow us to see our need of forgiveness.

I am sad to see all this debate over WCG on your "space". I wonder why all concerned don't "take it outside", or rather over to Tom's blog? Though you may feel differently and want to allow it. Just my opinion.

Grace, Peace and Love to you.

Tom Mahon said...

Maureen said...

>>I am sad to see all this debate over WCG on your "space". I wonder why all concerned don't "take it outside", or rather over to Tom's blog?<<

I certainly agree with you that Dan bringing up WCG was irrelevant. My comments on Jean's testimony had nothing to do with WCG.

Dan by devious means is trying to draw me into to debating whether WCG is cult, but I won't be taking the bait.

I note that though Dan is ready to criticise what Mr. Armstrong wrote, he is either unable or unwilling to show from the Scriptures why it is wrong. But I believe that all honest, objective and impartial observers can see that, except, perhaps, Lyn.

Tom Mahon said...

lyn said...

>>Dani'El is correct in calling out the obvious pride in Tom, as well as his cult system of beliefs.<<

Wow! And this from someone who thinks she is blessed with Christian humility.

zilch said...

That was a beautiful story, Jean. Even though I am an atheist, and don't believe in God, I do believe in the goodness in human hearts; and if you've found something that works for you, all I can say is, more power to you. Best wishes to you and your family.

cheers from chilly Vienna, Scott

Dani' El said...

Tom hissed- Dan by devious means is trying to draw me into to debating whether WCG is cult, but I won't be taking the bait.

Tom comes here, trying to spread his foul disease to our young sister Jean, disguised as a christian, concealing his cult connections, and he says I am devious?

I rebuke you Satan!

Maureen,
Tom is the one who brought this here. He has been here before, and he persists in attacking our dear sister with legalist accusations.
Maybe you are content to ignore that, or allow Satan a toehold in this new believer's life, but I for one serve the Lord.

We resist Satan and he flees.
We don't ignore him until he gets bored, or hope that he goes home to his cave.

You are like these who condemn Israel for executing righteous judgment on Hamas.
And like Hamas, Tom cries foul when he is challenged, after firing hundreds of rockets at civilians.

Either get in the game, or stop cheering for the wrong team.
--------------------

Tom,
You continue to refuse to answer for one reason.
You are concealing the truth, you are a member of the Armstrong cult, and I will continue to expose you, until you either repent or face judgment from God.

Eph 5:11 And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them.

Maureen said...

Dani'El: Yes, we should resist the Devil. If the Devil were to come to my blog, I would not allow his comments to dirty up my comment board. Jean also has this option.

"You are like these who condemn Israel for executing righteous judgment on Hamas.
And like Hamas, Tom cries foul when he is challenged, after firing hundreds of rockets at civilians.

Either get in the game, or stop cheering for the wrong team."

I guess I won't be "getting in the game" if it means judging and insulting fellow believers who have stopped by a dear girl's blog to encourage her in her journey with Christ.

lyn said...

Maureen~ may I suggest you check out the WCG on the internet, and the beliefs of its founder, Herbert Armstrong? Not everyone who claims to be a Christian is, we must be careful. Tom started out by attacking Jean's testimony, questioning her 'repentance'. Who is he to question the heart of a professing believer?
Tom has a past history of attacking Jean on her blog, and yes, Jean would be wise to delete his comments.
For starters, Armstrong claimed to be an 'apostle', which is impossible. An apostle had to have an eyewitness account of Christ in the flesh, while Christ walked this earth. There's more...Armstrong taught, 'God is more than a single person. He is not limited to a Triune God, but is a family and consist of many.'
The truth is, God is exalted above His creation, separate and holy from all mankind. His teachings on salvation are twisted as well-- Salvation
"God will ultimately save most of mankind after Christ's return - not now." "Every human who ever lived will have an opportunity to receive salvation For most people that time will come after they have lived their entire lives, died and are brought back to life in a future resurrection."
Copyright © Herbert W. Armstrong

This is why Dan and myself are trying to bring to light this cult religion of tom's. Please, understand the attack isn't on Tom personally, but his false set of beliefs that do NOT line up with scripture.
Remember the warning of Christ from Mat. 24:4, : "Take heed that no one deceives you." False teachers and false doctrine are a technique Satan uses to throw people off, and it is very effective.


Tom-AH!! the old throwback,
"Wow! And this from someone who thinks she is blessed with Christian humility."
So exposing false doctrine is a sign of arrogance? Not according to scripture, "Do not participate in the unfruitful deeds of darkness, but instead even expose them" Eph. 5:11

Dani' El said...

Maureen, did you not insult and judge us for rebuking Tom?
Seems you were in the game from the start.

I am here to praise God for my sister Jean's wonderful testimony,
to encourage and exhort her. She does the same for me on my blog.
But we also defend each other from attack. And we are attacked. You must be new here.

You wrote- I am sad to see all this debate over WCG on your "space". I wonder why all concerned don't "take it outside", or rather over to Tom's blog?

Tom is the one who has persisted in bringing it here to Jeans "space".
So to direct your criticism at "all concerned" as if we are part of the problem is to insult and judge us, throwing the baby out with the bath water.

And as you can see, Tom has used your comments to his advantage. Instead of resisting the devil, I now have to watch my back as well.

I will also add, there are things you are not aware of going on here.
So again, I ask you to either get in the game, or stop aiding the enemy.
We could use your help.

Maureen said...

lyn, I am aware of the WCG's wrong doctrines. I have been in similar discussions with Jehovahs Witnesses. I have also debated with fellow Christians over doctrine. I am all for defending the Truth, but there is a time and place. Again, I wonder why Jean should be host to this current discussion which seems to be spiralling downward into verbal fistacuffs? She has poured out her heart to us in sharing her beautiful story of how God in His mercy brought her to Himself. What was her intention in doing this? I would say that, whatever her intention was, her post brings much glory to God. The combative comments that I am referring to, however, do not. They are not edifying, and clearly Tom is not "open" to hear anything other than what he currently believes.

"Do not give what is holy to dogs, and do not throw your pearls before swine, or they will trample them under their feet,and turn and tear you to pieces." Matthew 7:6

I admire yours and Dan's zeal, but you might make better use of it by praying for the Holy Spirit to open Tom's heart and convict him of his error. I did check out his blog, and it seems a much more appropriate battle ground for the issue at hand, if you wish to carry on with it.

PS Ah Dan, I just read your latest comment. I do reject the notion that I rebuked and offended you by suggesting you move your debate elsewhere. That was a suggestion from a casual observer, made in my obvious naivte. And it does seem that I am NOT up to the level of intensity that is going on here. My apologies. Sorry to intrude. I too am concerned about Jean's being attacked. She does, however, appear to be able to respond with truth, in love. Also, she does have the option of moderating the comments on her blog.

A Sister

Dani' El said...

I admire yours and Dan's zeal, but you might make better use of it by praying for the Holy Spirit to open Tom's heart and convict him of his error. I did check out his blog, and it seems a much more appropriate battle ground for the issue at hand, if you wish to carry on with it.

Why do you assume we are not praying for Tom?
And we did not choose the battle ground, Tom did.
And it does not good to Tom not to rebuke and expose his demonic doctrines. I'll add, due to another earlier battle, there are a lot of lurkers on Jean's blog who could learn a thing or two about the cults.

PS Ah Dan, I just read your latest comment. I do reject the notion that I rebuked and offended you by suggesting you move your debate elsewhere.

Again, this is not my debate. It is a defense of my sister who is under attack. An attack that is having some effect in causing doubt and confusion to a young believer. Lyn and I have recommended that Jean block Tom's comments, but she is having problems figuring out how to do it.
Any suggestions?

If this is too intense for you, I suggest you read Jean's earlier post concerning her daughter. (maybe 2 or 3 below this one)
She has already survived a vicious onslaught from the enemy and I guess we are pretty protective of her as we should be.
We could use your help.

If not with your words of encouragement, your prayers are appreciated. But please do not give any ammo to our enemies.
You can see that Tom has twisted your comments to his advantage already.

I can see that you did indeed comment in ignorance so all is forgiven.

Ruth said...

HI Jean,
thanks so much for sharing your testimony :) just read it.
I too am a Registered Nurse, (not mental health) but I too have been wife & mother as my profession (homeschooling mom , my seventh and last year right now ) I also have three children as well. God is so good ! bless youuuuuu lots in Him and His wonderful heart , ruth

Jean said...

Sister Maureen said,
"Again, I wonder why Jean should be host to this current discussion which seems to be spiralling downward into verbal fistacuffs? She has poured out her heart to us in sharing her beautiful story of how God in His mercy brought her to Himself. What was her intention in doing this?"

Allow me to be honest dearest sister, before I post each blog I go before the Lord in prayer and I examine my motives and heart before I do so. I know I have been misunderstood many a times but I always write as the Lord leads. I am not looking for persecution, in fact my testimony has not always been well received (especially from people dearest to me) which has caused me great discouragement in my walk with the Lord. My relationships have suffered a great deal because of the testimony I have written here. I want to share what God has done for me, to declare His goodness and grace for an unworthy sinner like me, that's all.
As for Tom, I totally agree that he comes here just to attack me. I have the option of deleting his comments, but to be honest I have never deleted comments because someone has disagreed with me, why should I with Tom? Actually God has used him to teach me and enlighten me on some issues I was not clear about, Tom's tactics to attack me have actually worked for my own good because not only am I now aware of his dangerous cult, (with the help of brother Dan and sister Lyn exposing him, which I believe will also benefit other readers,) but have also learnt that He who is in me is greater than he that is in the world, for we do not fight against flesh and blood, but against principalities,powers and spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places, Ephesians 6:12. So this is not about Tom, but about the battle for the truth. At first I was attacked by atheists and false Christians, their hatred for the truth was so obvious, but now Satan is not using the obvious, but those who creep in disguised as ministers of righteousness. God helped me in my previous attacks with atheists, and he silenced them, why should I not trust God to defeat those who come here disguised as ministers of light, will God not deal with those as well, why should I be too quick to trust in myself and turn on comment moderation or ban Tom from posting, let the darkness be exposed so all may see that their deeds are evil. God will deal with those who are evil, I trust Him, vengeance is His, He will repay.

As for comment moderation I do not always have the time to moderate comments, I have 3 young children all under the age of 5, I am a homemaker and a wife, not to mention other commitments I have to attend to like bible reading etc. I also prefer to spend time away from this blog at times as its good for me spiritually. I am happy for readers to dialogue without me checking each comment all the time, that's what I have always done on this blog and I prefer it that way, unless of cause I really have to turn on comment moderation.

Blessings

Jean :)

Dani' El said...

Well said Sister Jean.
Truly God has blessed you with understanding, especially for such a newly born saint.

All glory to the Father and His Holy One, Messiah Yeshua!!!

Baruch HaShem!
Dani' El

Tom Mahon said...

Jean said...

>>As for Tom, I totally agree that he comes here just to attack me.<<

Well, perhaps I will never be able to persuade you that I am not attacking you nor anyone else, for that matter.

I participate in many forums, and all I do is read what people say, and asked questions or make comments. Sometimes my comments may be intended to get people to support what they say with supporting evidence or explain the rationale behind their assertions. For example, Dan posted the following: "God wants everyone of us to eventually become like Him." "Why should it seem strange that you will someday be the spirit-composed child of your heavenly Father? You will be what He is - God." "God's PURPOSE in having created humanity - in having caused YOU to be born - is to reproduce Himself."
Copyright © Herbert W. Armstrong<<

I asked Dan on two occasions to show from the bible that what Mr. Armstrong wrote is wrong. But instead showing how wrong it is, so that I could renounce it, he decided to revile me and labelled me an agent of the devil. Is this how rational people behave? I doubt it.

>>I have the option of deleting his comments, but to be honest I have never deleted comments because someone has disagreed with me, why should I with Tom?<<

BRAVO! Neither have I ever deleted anyone's comments because they disagree with me. In fact, when people challenged the things I believe, their challenge provides the opportunity for me to study again and reconfirmed the truth that the Holy Spirit of Truth has revealed to me.

You will also note that while some of the participants here are ready to judge me as a agent of the devil, and to call me every name under the sun, I have neither judged nor abused anyone. So if your policy is to delete obscene and offensive comments, perhaps Dan won't be too upset if you start deleting some of his comments?

lyn said...

Jean, your response was truly God-honoring! May the Lord continue to use you for His glory, may He bless you, Dani'El, Maureen, and all who stand firm in the faith. The battle is the Lord's, we have nothing to fret over. I pray we all bear in mind to honor Him in our thoughts, our speech, and our actions. May we walk in the Spirit, and allow Him to guide us.

"He has shown you, O man, what [is] good; And what does the LORD require of you But to do justly, To love mercy, And to walk humbly with your God?" Micah 6:8

Sunshine said...

Jean,

I praise God for your testimony! Such a powerful story. I just wanted to share with you that I too was recently saved and I can definitely relate to some of the things you went through. ESPECIALLY, that desire to tell EVERYONE about Jesus and everything He has done for us! Also, I enjoy your other posts. Keep em comin!

In Christ,

Lauren

Jean said...

Thank you Lauren, God bless you :) Keep the faith sister...